HomeMy WebLinkAbout1997-11-18 Park Board MinutesEDINA PARK BOARD
7:30 p.m.
November 18, 1997
_____________________________
MEMBERS PRESENT: Becky Bennett, Dave Crowther, Beth Hall, Andy Herring, Bill Jenkins,
Andrew Montgomery, Jean Rydell
MEMBERS ABSENT: Phyllis Kohler, Michael Burley, John Dovolis, Jim Fee
STAFF PRESENT: John Keprios, Ed MacHolda, Janet Canton, Susan Weigle, John Valliere,
Larry Thayer
OTHERS PRESENT: Marjorie Ruedy, Joyce Hirabayashi, Martin Hirabayashi, Sue Weigle,
Jason Wiley, Gayle Gaumer, Jeff Arnold, Baba Honmyhr, Lila Larson, Kay
Bach, Harold Larson, Charlotte Burrell, Jeanne Fish, LeRoy Fish
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I. APPROVAL OF THE OCTOBER 14, 1997 PARK BOARD MINUTES
Jean Rydell MOVED TO APPROVE THE OCTOBER 14, 1997 PARK BOARD MINUTES. Bill
Jenkins SECONDED THE MOTION. MINUTES APPROVED.
II. WALNUT RIDGE PARK MASTER PLAN
Mr. Keprios explained there was a meeting with the Walnut Ridge neighborhood on November
5th, in which there was a standing room only crowd, which was mainly due to false information
that was distributed to numerous residents in the area by an unknown source. It took a lot of
time to clarify misleading information that the residents were concerned about. Mr. Keprios
indicated that otherwise it was a good meeting that resulted in good discussion sharing of
ideas.
Mr. Keprios pointed out there has been and still is some division among the neighbors
regarding the size of the building, as well as, some of the futuristic master plans. He
explained that a year ago staff proposed that a new park shelter building be located right
where the current hockey rink exists, mainly due to easy access from the parking lot. This
would mean relocating the hockey rink. Based on input from neighbors who attended the Park
Board meeting, the Park Board decided not to relocate the hockey rink. Mr. Keprios also
noted that at that time they also heard a lot of ideas from the residents regarding the master
plan.
Mr. Keprios stated that the architects came up with some plans for the shelter buildings and as
it turned out all of the bids were rejected because they were too expensive. Therefore, they
went back to the drawing board and came up with two separate plans, a small shelter building
and a large shelter building. He indicated that questions were asked as to what are the uses
of these park shelter buildings. He explained they are for:
• Warming house for changing skates during the winter months.
• Serve the playground program during the summer months.
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• Provide public access to restrooms during daylight hours year-round.
• Available for civic and social group meetings.
He added that the restrooms will be unlocked during daylight hours and locked during night
hours automatically through the electronic keyless entry system. Mr. Keprios commented that
the buildings would be aesthetically pleasing and large enough to hold meetings as well as
suffice for private rental, birthday parties, family celebrations, etc.
Mr. Keprios stated that the only difference between the two buildings is simply square footage,
whereas, the mechanical and electrical designs of the two buildings are exactly the same. He
noted that the larger building will be placed at Cornelia School Park and Weber Park and the
smaller ones at Todd Park and Walnut Ridge Park. A couple reasons being that Cornelia
School wants to use it for additional school programs such as Kids Club and Weber Park is
going to continue as a voting site. Mr. Keprios pointed out that the smaller size building will be
at Walnut Ridge Park and Todd Park. He noted that the difference in price between the two
buildings is $10,000. The cost is roughly $237,000 versus $227,000. Mr. Keprios indicated
that the square footage for the smaller building is 1,187 sq. ft. versus the larger building which
has an additional 400 sq. ft. He noted that the additional square footage in the larger building
is basically picked up in the great room. Mr. Keprios pointed out the occupant load in the
smaller building is 88 and in the larger building is 167.
Mr. Keprios explained how the new shelter buildings compare in size to what is currently in our
system. The smaller shelter building great room will be 617 sq. ft., whereas, the square
footage of the great rooms at Arden Park, Normandale, Strachauer and Countryside is 378 sq.
ft. In other words, the smaller building is 239 square feet larger than what we currently have
in our park system.
Mr. Keprios indicated that staff is recommending to go with the smaller of the two buildings for
Walnut Ridge and Todd Park but if the Park Board and community feel they would be better
served with the larger of the two he would be okay with that. Mr. Keprios stated, however, that
another consideration is that the larger building is not just an additional $10,000 but we also
need to look at additional maintenance, cost of heating, cleaning, etc., it all adds up. He also
asked do we really need to house 150 people at those two particular parks, especially with the
current parking that is there.
Mr. Keprios stated that Mr. Crowther, Mr. Jenkins and Mr. Montgomery all attended the Walnut
Ridge Park neighborhood meeting on November 5th. He noted that it appeared as though less
than half of those in attendance felt the smaller building would be just fine. However, the other
half felt that somehow they were getting short changed and felt they deserve the larger facility.
Mr. Crowther asked Mr. Keprios to review where the money is coming from for this, as well as,
where we currently stand. Mr. Keprios explained that he wishes he could tell everyone we
have all kinds of money to do all of the shelter buildings as well as the rest of the projects we
still have on our plate. However, the shelter buildings as well as a lot of the other park
improvement projects were sticker price shock to him as well as to a lot of other people.
Therefore, the bottom line is we don’t have enough money left over now to cover all the costs
of all the remaining projects. There is not enough money to complete the shelter building
projects, however, he has been reassured by the City Manager that we will work hard to find
the money to complete the shelter buildings because it is something that was promised to the
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community. All of the other improvements we are going to have to do through our operating
budget.
Mr. Wiley, resident, indicated that he is a little surprised that staff recommended the smaller
building. He felt there was a strong feeling from the group and that the Park Board would
forward the recommendation for the larger building. He stated that an additional $10,000 is
5% more but you would get 25% more space, which seems like a good buy.
Mr. Jenkins corrected Mr. Wiley and noted that when he was asked where does the Park
Board stand on the building he commented that he would bring it back to the other Park Board
members to discuss. He stated that there was no final decision made at the November 5th
meeting. Mr. Jenkins noted that he felt there was a split among the audience between the
large building and the small building.
Jeff Arnold, resident, indicated that he has no strong feeling one way or another on the size of
the building. However, what is important to him is the location of the building. Mr.
Montgomery commented that he doesn’t see Walnut Ridge Park as needing the larger
building, especially since there is inadequate parking for it. He noted that he sees the master
plan as being much more important than the size of the building. Mr. Montgomery indicated
that his understanding is the location has been somewhat pinpointed in that it will be
immediately to the south of the existing hockey rink and on the east side of the walking path.
Mr. Arnold indicated that he thought the original proposal made the most sense, to place the
building immediately east of the parking, where the current hockey rink is. Mr. Keprios
explained that Mr. Arnold was out of town when they held the meeting where the
neighborhood went around and around on this issue. He noted that one thing the residents
did feel strongly about was to leave the hockey rink where it is and the Park Board at that time
decided to not relocate the hockey rink.
Jean Rydell MOVED TO APPROVE STAFF’S RECOMMENDATION TO GO FORWARD
WITH THE SMALLER SIZE PARK SHELTER BUILDING DESIGN IN THE SITE LOCATION
PREVIOUSLY APPROVED BY THE PARK BOARD. Bill Jenkins SECONDED MOTION.
MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
Mr. Keprios thanked the three Park Board members who attended the November 5th meeting
with the Walnut Ridge Park neighborhood.
III. SENIOR CITIZEN CENTER
Mr. Keprios explained that the issue of the Senior Center has been around for quite awhile
and complimented the seniors for their patience. Mr. Keprios explained there has been the
possibility of having the senior center connected with the YMCA. The next possibility is adding
the senior center to the south end of the Edina Community Center. Mr. Keprios stated that he
has currently attended two meetings with the Senior Center Advisory Committee. He
explained that the committee has listed the advantages and disadvantages of the four different
possibilities proposed. Mr. Keprios indicated that their first choice would be to have a free
standing building. Their second choice would be adding on to the south end of the Community
Center. Their third choice would be the connection with the YMCA and were they are currently
located would be their least preferred choice.
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Mr. Keprios informed the Park Board that there is now a fifth option. The City Council has
been attending the League of Women Voters town meetings and there has been a lot of
interest and talk about building a recreation community center. Therefore, we need to look at
the possibility of adding a senior center to that to make it a multiple-use facility. Mr. Keprios
stated that he has been directed by the City Manager to interview every director of every
community center in the twin city area. He needs to research all of these facilities and find out
what they have in their community and find out what they have for a senior center as well as
look at the dollar figures. Mr. Keprios stated that once he has all of this information together
there’s going to be a meeting in January with the City Council, City Manager and staff to
discuss a lot of issues, one of which will be the Senior Center and the possibility of a
recreation center. A lot of issues will likely be addressed at this meeting in efforts to analyze
availability of existing facilities, maximize resources and avoid duplication of services.
Ms. Weigle, Director of Edina Senior Center, indicated that she was surprised when the Senior
Citizen Advisory Council went through the exercise of listing the different advantages and
disadvantages and came up with the recommendation of a free standing building. She stated
that it did make the most logical sense. Also, just like any other recreational facility, eventually
everyone is going to get a chance to use it. This isn’t just for the people who are seniors right
now. Ms. Weigle commented that they have come up with the motto “do it right the first time”.
Ms. Weigle stated that Mr. Keprios brought up the idea of an all-purpose community center
and she felt most of the seniors would be in favor of this and do realize that it would not
happen for awhile. However, they would be willing to wait.
Mr. Montgomery asked if the Southdale tennis club facility has been explored. A resident
commented that she played tennis there and the parking is terrible. She also noted that it
would have to be torn down and redesigned. However, the property itself would be wonderful
for a senior center.
Mr. Montgomery asked what area the seniors would like for a free standing building and she
Weigle replied they all like Lake Cornelia Park and feel that would be a great spot. Ms. Weigle
stated that most of the senior centers they have visited have been in such lovely locations and
they feel Lake Cornelia would be wonderful.
Mr. Crowther asked Mr. Keprios what his recommendation is and he replied he would
recommend we hold off on this until he has completed his research and fact finding, which will
be the first or second week of January. He noted he has a feeling that the City Council may
come up with a recommendation to bring back to the Park Board for discussion.
Mr. Jenkins indicated to the seniors that the Park Board is open to a free standing option if it
makes sense. Ms. Weigle stated that the seniors just want to know that the Park Board
supports this and are in favor.
Andy Herring MOVED TO TABLE THE SENIOR CENTER ISSUE AT THIS TIME. Jean Rydell
SECONDED THE MOTION. MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
IV. FEES AND CHARGES
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Mr. Herring commented that looking over the fees and charges it looks like it costs $20,000 a
year to maintain the bandy rink and the bandy players are only paying approximately $10,000
for the use of that rink. Mr. Keprios explained that, regarding the facility use fee, bandy is
looked upon the same as any other sport in that pays the $6.00 per participant fee. He noted
that in adult team sports it is pro-rated so that it comes out the same for both youth and adults
and it is called a “maintenance fee”. Mr. Keprios pointed out that it is not designed to cover all
of the costs, in fact, some associations pay more and others less than what it actually costs to
maintain the different fields, rinks, etc. He indicated that long ago the City Council decided it
was best to charge a flat fee across the board.
Mr. Herring stated there are less than 10% Edina residents playing bandy and he is troubled
that the city is covering costs for over 90% of the participants who are non-residents. Ms.
Bennett brought up the point that a lot of residents who don’t play bandy still enjoy using the
bandy rink. Mr. Herring proposed that the fees be increased by approximately $300.00, he
feels the players need to bear more of the costs. He also indicated that Mr. MacHolda’s time
to manage to this program has not been taken into account and he has been told that is not a
small task. Mr. Herring asked Mr. MacHolda if he feels the numbers should be higher. Mr.
MacHolda indicated that he is not going to disagree because it currently is a program where
it’s priced at a point where it’s tough to get participation. Mr. Jenkins asked why don’t we just
wrap it up and be done with it. Mr. MacHolda commented that word of mouth is they want to
play but again it’s tough for them as managers and participants to come up with the cash. Mr.
Crowther noted that it would seem to him that the program could be shut down next year.
However, we could still maintain a nice big ice rink but we wouldn’t have to devote all of the
resources to make it a bandy rink. He noted that the bandy rink could be cut in half and it
would still be the largest sheet of ice in the city. It would serve its purpose and would cost half
as much money. Mr. Jenkins asked if there is no bandy in Edina where would the bandy
players go and it was noted they would likely play at the Oval in Roseville.
Ms. Bennett asked about youth bandy and Mr. MacHolda replied there are approximately 10 to
15 players in Edina. Ms. Bennett noted that is something she always wanted to see publicized
more. Mr. MacHolda pointed out there has never been more than a dozen participants in
youth bandy and commented that the bandy people have tried hard to promote their sport.
Mr. Keprios explained that we need to remember that the former Park Director, Mr. Kojetin,
brought bandy to the United States many years ago in an international softball/bandy
exchange program. Mr. Keprios stated that he doesn’t think it will ever be 100% Edina
residents. Mr. Keprios commented that bandy needs a place to play in order for the sport to
keep going.
Mr. Herring asked that this topic be put on the calendar for next summer so that the Park
Board can talk about it in time before it needs to be advertised. The reason being it is his
feeling that the bandy players are not paying enough for the time and energy that goes into the
program so that a possible change could be made for next fall.
Mr. Herring indicated that the fees and charges show a 30% increase at the aquatic center
and he feels that increase is too big. He noted this past summer was rough and we now have
a lot of competition, therefore, he would like the aquatic center to continue to be a good value.
He stated that he understands we need to cover our costs, however, a 30% increase is too
much.
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Mr. MacHolda responded that Mr. Herring is right in that it is a large increase. However, the
last time season tickets were increased was 1992, so for six seasons the fees for the season
ticket remained the same. Mr. Herring asked if that is when the rate changed from a fixed cost
for a family versus the two and then pay per each additional person. Mr. MacHolda indicated
that in 1991 the pool was renovated, a water slide was added and the traditional wading pool
was changed to a zero-depth pool with a play structure. Therefore, fees were increased
slightly in 1992. The daily admission in 1991 was $2.50 and it was raised to $5.00. The
season tickets were increased by $5.00, they went $40.00 to $45.00. Since that time,
however, the season ticket has not gone up. Last summer, although, the daily admission rate
did go up $1.00 to $6.00. Mr. Herring noted that he thought there used to be one fee for an
entire family. Mr. MacHolda explained that was changed in 1993, if it was a family of four it
stayed the same, if it was less than four the fee went down and more than four the fee went
up.
Mr. MacHolda indicated that last summer St. Louis Park opened up their renovated facility and
even though we are not the exact same, St. Louis Park is the only facility that is close to what
Edina has in terms of amenities. The fee for a family of four at St. Louis this past year was
$110.00 and if an early bird season ticket was purchased it was $100.00. A non-resident
family of four was $150.00.
Mr. MacHolda indicated that the facility still needs to pay back $140,000 for the play structure
as well as pay back $208,000 to the Developer’s Fund, which helped to pay for the new
bathhouse. Mr. MacHolda noted that he agrees the aquatic center has been a great value and
we haven’t needed to raise the fees. Also, the cash reports have been better simply because
the numbers keep growing. Mr. Herring asked Mr. MacHolda when he projects the
Developer’s Fund will be paid back as well as the play structure. Mr. MacHolda replied he is
unclear as to what’s going to transpire when all of the bond referendum money is spent. Mr.
Keprios commented that schedule still has to be worked out. However, what is on the
schedule is we have to pay back the renovation from 1991 and that dollar figure escalates
every year until the year 2013, at which point it doubles from what it is now. He noted that it is
now approximately $20,000.
Mr. Crowther asked Mr. MacHolda if he feels the increase in the rates will scare people away.
He noted that their options would be to go to St. Louis Park, which is more expensive, or stop
swimming.
Mr. Herring again commented that it strikes him as too large of an increase. Mr. MacHolda
pointed out that he would have made an increase a year ago, however with the aquatic center
being under construction and not knowing when the opening date would be he felt he could
not raise the fees. However, he never received a complaint regarding the fees and charges,
he only received complaints that the pool was not open. Mr. Herring stated that looking at the
numbers with an increase of 30% the pool would theoretically make $200,000 and do we need
to make that much from the pool.
Mr. Jenkins indicated that we have some capital that needs to be repaid. Mr. Keprios stated
that the people are getting more for their money, they are getting a new building, new filtration
system, a new wading pool and $140,000 worth of new and exciting water playground
equipment.
Mr. MacHolda explained that for the aquatic center 1995 and 1996 were great years, income
before depreciation was $100,000 in 1995 and $105,000 in 1996. However, if you were to
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look at this over the last 20 year period it was approximately $20,000 to $40,000 and that is
why communities have struggled to build a new facility. Typically pools are a deficit facility.
Mr. MacHolda pointed out that a couple of things happened in 1995 and 1996. First, mother
nature and that’s a number one draw. Secondly, we had a really nice combination of water
amenities, however, we are no longer the only person in town with such water amenities. Mr.
MacHolda indicated that St. Louis Park took away exactly what he thought they would in terms
of season tickets, we went from 3,000 season tickets to 2,200. Mr. Herring asked how could
he compare because the pool was not even open. Mr. MacHolda stated that it’s the non-
resident that brought in the extra needed revenues. We went from 1,000 non-resident season
tickets to 200 non-residents.
Ms. Rydell asked if the aquatic center could offer an early bird similar to St. Louis Park’s. Mr.
MacHolda stated that he would like to see an early bird offered. Mr. MacHolda also pointed
out that Bloomington, Richfield and Apple Valley are all doing renovations so we will eventually
have even more competition. Therefore, he feels we will likely lose even more non-resident
patrons.
Mr. Crowther asked Mr. Keprios what his thoughts are on this. Mr. Keprios replied that he has
been through this discussion with Mr. MacHolda. He noted that part of him wants to create
some good will by rewarding those who have served us for all of these years and thank them
for all of their patronage and apologize for the construction delays they put up with last year.
However, we also need money, because if we don’t have the dollars down the road to
maintain and make future improvements, we are going to fall behind again. Mr. Keprios noted
that now he thinks people are getting a bigger bang for their buck and we have competition
whose fee is significantly higher than ours. Therefore, percentage wise it is a big jump,
however, we have greatly improved the value of the facility. Mr. Keprios stated that he
supports Mr. MacHolda's recommendation.
Mr. Montgomery asked is there any discount capability available for early registrations, and Mr.
MacHolda replied yes.
Bill Jenkins MOVED THAT THE PARK BOARD RECOMMEND TO THE CITY COUNCIL
THAT WE GO WITH THE STAFF’S RECOMMENDATIONS AS THEY ARE LISTED AND
FORMULATE SOME TYPE OF EARLY BIRD DISCOUNT.
Mr. Herring commented that he feels that is a good compromise because if someone thinks it
is too much they can do something about it.
Mr. Herring asked Mr. Valliere why he didn’t increase the cart fee and Mr. Valliere explained
because they raised that fee $2.00 last year.
Mr. Valliere indicated that he would like to address the question that was brought up at the
October Park Board meeting regarding the executive course and the Fred Richards Golf
Course. He explained that when the executive course was built we already owned the
property and the cost to build the facility was $275,000. When the Richards golf course was
built in 1993 we had to buy the property for $850,000, build a new facility for one million dollars
and build a clubhouse for $450,000. Therefore, there was an immense new debt and we
projected right away that we could not meet debt service and operating costs. That basically
is why there is a difference in green fees between the two courses. Therefore, it became a
situation where Braemar had to support the Richards course somewhat. Mr. Valliere noted
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that in justification they try to not transfer all of that debt service to golfing at Braemar. There
are two different prices, however, he hopes one day the prices will be equal.
Mr. Herring indicated that he felt the fee for Champion Putting was a little high and asked if
that could be reduced. Mr. Keprios replied they feel people will pay that but if Mr. Herring
would like to make a recommendation he certainly can. Mr. Herring asked if there is debt
service there and Mr. Keprios noted yes. It is his understanding that the dollars used to build
the course came out of the Edinborough/Centennial trust fund so they are going to try to
recover some of that cost through the fees and charges. Mr. Crowther noted that it doesn’t
seem right that it costs $7.00 for 18 holes of putting versus $9.00 for the executive golf course.
Mr. Herring noted that he would like to see this fee at $5.00, however he would go with $6.00.
Mr. Crowther asked Mr. Thayer if our ice rates are too cheap and Mr. Thayer pointed out that
the ice rental rates are at the same competitive price compared to other communities that they
have been for the last four or five years.
Ms. Bennett asked why the Friday night skating is no longer offered. Mr. Thayer explained
that four years ago the High School Board of Education created the opportunity for a girls
varsity hockey program. Therefore, at that time pressure was immediately put upon him to
find Monday through Friday hours for their program. He indicated that he had to take hours
from everyone, hockey, figure skating, lessons and open skating to help get the girls program
off the ground. Mr. Thayer then pointed out that the following year the Board of Education
decided to start school classes later. The ramifications of that decision meant that the three
high school hockey teams couldn’t come to the facility until 4:00 p.m., which put even more of
a strain on the same type of hours. The same formula was again used to try to accommodate
the program. Therefore, the net effect of this year with the third sheet of ice sheet coming on
is we hope to not have to cancel any open skating sessions during any tournaments and figure
skating competitions as well as other special events. Mr. Thayer indicated that there are
probably going to be about 40 public skating hours, that normally would have been canceled.
Also, the hockey association will gain some hours back as well not have to practice before
school, but have hours similar to what they have had in the past. Mr. Thayer explained the
reason the Tuesday and Friday evening skating times were canceled was a simple financial
one. He noted that once the teams are selected, the players are usually skating so heavily
that there is not a lot of time to go public skating, at least Monday through Friday. Ms. Bennett
asked Mr. Thayer if he sees the Friday night public skating coming back. Mr. Thayer
responded that a Friday night session would really cut into all of the entities pretty heavily.
However, he noted that a Saturday evening, 1 ½ hour session for families only, would be his
recommendation. Mr. Thayer stressed that he would like to see the stipulation that an adult
does need to be there. He also pointed out that every time a session is brought back like this
it has negative financial implications and takes away approximately two teams worth of home
ice for the season.
Dave Crowther MOVED TO ACCEPT STAFF'S 1998 FEES AND CHARGES PROPOSAL
WITH TWO EXCEPTIONS:
1. THERE WILL BE A REASONABLE EARLY BIRD PRICE OFFERING FOR THE AQUATIC
CENTER.
2. THE CHAMPION PUTTING FEE WOULD BE $6.00.
Jean Rydell SECONDED THE MOTION. MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
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V. OTHER
A. Edina Swim Club - Mr. Montgomery asked how much money was given up in pool rental
fees for the Edina Swim Club and Mr. MacHolda noted that it is about $5,000. Mr.
Montgomery asked how much did we charge for the use of the facility for the Aquatennial
Swim Meet and Mr. MacHolda noted approximately $3,500.00. Mr. Montgomery commented
that his understanding is we are going to be able to use the pool that weekend, however, we
are giving up the $5,000 pool rental for the season. Mr. Montgomery noted that the intent is
the following year they may have that rental if they use a June weekend and Mr. MacHolda
replied yes, that is his understanding.
Mr. Herring pointed out that the staff report indicates that the 1999 swim meet plans are yet to
be determined, however, Mr. Rosland’s letter and the minutes from the Edina Swim Club go
on the record as saying you have committed to letting them in for 1999. Mr. Keprios explained
that if the Swim Club returns to Edina in July of 1999 they are going to have to make
accommodations to have allow public access to the wading pool during their Swim Meet. Mr.
Rosland basically told them that if they want to use the pool in June then they can basically
have it all to themselves.
Mr. Crowther pointed out that it would seem to him that this should go on the docket with the
other issues for next year so that early on we can be more unified as a Park Board on what we
want to see offered to the Swim Club. He indicated that if the Park Board does not like what
Mr. Rosland has committed to for the future then we have to voice that to him and tell him
what we think from a Park Board standpoint. Mr. Keprios noted that the City Council and Mr.
Rosland would more than welcome the Park Board’s comments.
Mr. Herring asked that staff calendar the discussion of the 1999 Aquatennial Swim Meet when
they feel it would be appropriate because he would like to re-discuss this as a group because
he is not totally on board with the deal that was cut. He noted that maybe they will agree that
it’s the right thing but he would like to be able to give everyone enough notice. Mr. Keprios
stated that he will have Mr. MacHolda contact the Edina Swim Club so we know what dates
they are committed to because he would think they would have to know fairly soon to make
plans for 1999.
B. Hockey and Soccer - Mr. Keprios indicated that he received a call from Gail Gaumer who
is very, very concerned about a couple of issues regarding hockey and soccer.
Ms. Gaumer explained that her daughter plays hockey and it has come to her attention that
children the same age who play at different levels of hockey do not get the same number of
indoor ice hours and there is no rationale basis for it. She stated that if anyone can give her a
good reason why one 10 year-old should be entitled to more access to public facilities than
another, she would love to hear it. She indicated that they all pay the same fee, however, it’s
not the money. Her daughter wants the equal access to be on that ice.
Ms. Gaumer explained that with soccer in the past there has been a tournament team
comprised entirely of Edina residents. This team, although, was not able to access the Edina
public fields because they are not affiliated with the Edina Soccer Association or Edina Soccer
Club. However, there is another organization, which is not 100% Edina residents, which does
have access to the public fields. Again, she commented that any time a team is made up of
substantially Edina residents at the same level of play they should all have equal access.
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Mr. Montgomery stated that he feels Ms. Gaumer has an issue that’s obviously of concern,
however, he noted that he does not feel we are going to be able to make a decision tonight.
He noted that he has offered to meet with Ms. Gaumer and Mr. Keprios and give Mr. Keprios
some time to gather the facts on the issue before any type of decision can be made as a Park
Board.
Mr. Crowther asked Ms. Gaumer if she has approached the Edina Hockey Association and
she indicated that she was at their first meeting of the year regarding this issue and it was her
impression they were going to do something about it, however, that was not the case.
Mr. Montgomery asked if this tournament soccer team is another Bangu. Ms. Gaumer
explained that Soccer Edina refused to allow a tournament team called “The Hurricanes” to
affiliate with them so that the Hurricanes could reserve field times. She stated that she doesn’t
know why they didn’t want a tournament team because Soccer Edina did not have a
tournament team. She noted that this tournament team is for children who want to play
traveling soccer on the weekends only because they do not want to give up baseball.
Mr. Herring indicated that he needs to get staff’s input on both of these issues and have the
facts in front of him which is not going to happen tonight. He noted Ms. Gaumer has some
very valid concerns and they should be addressed. However, he needs to see the facts
because there are always two sides.
Mr. Keprios indicated that he does have some short-term and long-term plans. He indicated
that his short-term plan is to talk to the Edina Hockey Association to resolve a couple of issues
which need immediate attention. He stated that the long-range plan is not a new issue for the
Park Board. It is something that was previously proposed by staff and will require research
and input from all the athletic associations. He noted that he has already done some research
and currently has a rough draft policy that addresses the issue of equal access, equality, what
teams will be recognized, who legally should have access to the facilities, what restrictions
should be put on the associations, how do they form their boards and how were they elected.
He noted that what it comes down to is there needs to be some restrictions, policies and
mandates approved by the city. He indicated that other communities are going through similar
exercises because there are people who feel that they can do a better job with these kids than
what the present system currently provides. He noted that we can learn a lot from what these
other communities have come up with and indicated that he is going to go on the coattails of
some of what their policies have that addresses this very issue.
Ms. Gaumer commented that the City of Edina will be the ones liable for any discrimination on
the basis of failure to provide equal access to public facilities to all residents on a rationale
basis. Ms. Gaumer commented that the City is responsible for how the Edina Hockey
Association uses that ice.
Mr. Keprios indicated that Ms. Gaumer raises a valid point and it’s something we are very
serious about and we are going to look into it. He noted that there is no way everyone is going
to have equal ice time this season and we will soon debate whether or not everyone is entitled
to equal ice time. However, we are planning to study this and we are going to come to some
resolve.
11
C. Braemar Walking Path - Mr. Valliere introduced Gerald Brimmacombe and indicated that
he has a concern relative to the park trail on the south side of Braemar. Mr. Valliere indicated
that when the golf course built its new nine in 1993 they displaced a trail through the south
part of the park and noted that the promise at that time was that we would move the trail
toward the wooded area.
Gerald Brimmacombe noted that he has lived by the north edge of Braemar Golf for 28 years
and there is a wonderful hiking trail, however, it has been languishing for the last five or six
years uncompleted. Therefore, if there is some way you can take care of this connection
along the southern edge of the golf course, it would make a tremendous hiking trail. There is
a lot of wildlife back there. Mr. Brimmacombe also commented that there are some serious
erosion problems.
Mr. Keprios indicated that he is aware of the erosion and we hope to get an Boy Scout to take
this on as an Eagle Scout project, similar to what was done by an Eagle Scout at Normandale
Park. The plan is to have Boy Scouts install some landscape wood ties to create a switch-
back, which will essentially eliminate the erosion. This is a very effective and inexpensive way
to get the job done.
Mr. Keprios stated that they have always had it in their minds that when they get the dollars to
complete the path they would like to see it go on the south side and maybe try to find some
protection from the balls. He feels that is where it belongs because people want to continue
all the way around. Mr. Keprios commented that the only thing that is holding the project up
right now is the legal system. He explained that they have been trying to acquire easements
for years. Mr. Keprios stated that he feels confident that the trail will be connected on the
south end and will some day also be connected into Eden Prairie's and Bloomington's trail
system.
D. Bantam Hockey - Mr. Herring explained that he has been notified that a grading took
place over the weekend with a Bantam “C” hockey team to determine which four kids would
have to play hockey in St. Louis Park or Hopkins. He noted that doesn’t seem consistent with
our philosophy. Mr. Herring stated that he doesn’t have all of the facts but there has been a
lot of talk as to whether these kids were forced or wholly volunteered. He indicated that that
he is very troubled by this and would like to know what the facts are. Mr. Keprios replied that
is one of the reasons he is meeting with some members of the hockey association tomorrow,
to get the facts on what occurred. Mr. Herring asked that Mr. Keprios to report back on this
issue at the next Park Board meeting.
VI. ADJOURNMENT
Dave Crowther MOVED TO ADJOURN THE MEETING AT 9:40 P.M. Jean Rydell
SECONDED THE MOTION. MEETING ADJOURNED.