HomeMy WebLinkAbout1994-11-08 Park Board MinutesEDINA PARK BOARD
8:00 p.m.
November 8, 1994
MEMBERS PRESENT: Andrew Herring, Jean Rydell, Andrew Montgomery, Beth Hall,
Ernie Fischer, Dave Crowther, Becky Bennett, John Dovolis,
Bill Jenkins
MEMBERS ABSENT: Bill Lord, Jim Fee
STAFF PRESENT: John Keprios, Ed MacHolda, Janet Canton, John Valliere
OTHERS PRESENT: Richard Coonrod, Harvey Dow, Theodore Hanson, Gary Zachman,
Erin Zachman
I. APPROVAL OF THE SEPTEMBER 13. 1994 MINUTES
Jean Rydell MOVED TO APPROVE THE SEPTEMBER 13, 1994 MINUTES. Ernie
Fischer SECONDED THE MOTION. MINUTES APPROVED.
II. BRAEMAR TENNIS COURTS - RICHARD COONROD
Mr. Keprios distributed a letter that he received from Richard Coonrod.
The letter indicated that the Braemar area residents will contribute 30%
of the renovation/reconstruction cost, not to exceed $3,500, to restore
Braemar's tennis courts to recreational playing condition.
Mr. Coonrod stated that he doesn't have a lot to add to the letter. He
pointed out that he feels there is a significant interest in the
preservation of the Braemar tennis courts. He also noted that he hopes
the willingness to contribute for the restoration would influence the
Park Board's decision to reverse their call on the asset. Mr. Coonrod
indicated that he believes the asset is of significantly greater value
than they can justify in tearing it out. He also explained that the
numbers indicate it would be in excess of $37,000 to replace that kind
of an asset in this community. He then noted that if he didn't think he
could go to the community and raise these funds he wouldn't be here.
Mr. Coonrod stated that if the Park Board has some question about this
he would be glad to personally make a contribution and take the risk
himself. Mr. Coonrod went on to explain that the tennis courts are in
the right place, however, they have not been used because they have not
been maintained. There are a lot of people who would certainly enjoy
the benefit of the asset over time.
Mr. Fischer asked if there would be any feeling of preferential
treatment or priority on the part of those who donate money towards this
project. Mr. Coonrod replied there would absolutely be none.
Mr. Herring asked Mr. Keprios what the maintenance costs are beyond the
upgrade. Mr. Keprios indicated that the way they should be maintained
is a minimum of every four years. However, we are not currently funded
to keep up with that kind of a schedule. Every six to seven years
approximately $3,500 to $4,000 is spent per battery of two courts.
Mr. Montgomery stated that he and Ms. Rydell reviewed all of tennis
courts in Edina. He noted that as an individual he has played tennis
for the last 20 years in Edina and has seen a decline in the sport. Mr.
Montgomery indicated that Braemar is a beautiful setting for a tennis
court but there are a lot of other tennis courts that are nearby. Mr.
Coonrod noted that he disagrees with Mr. Montgomery on the accessibility
issue. He stated that there are a lot of children in the area who would
have to ride their bicycles a mile and a half to get to those other
courts. Mr. Coonrod then indicated that he recently saw on television
that city residents are coming back to tennis as opposed to basketball
for a lot of inner city recreational play. Mr. Coonrod then stated that
this is a class facility and it really is a shame not to preserve it.
Mr. Jenkins explained to Mr. Coonrod that this issue started about two
years ago and that the Park Board does not want to close any tennis
courts just as they don't want to close any skating rinks. However, the
city is working with a fixed budget and therefore we need to prioritize
things and make hard decisions. Mr. Jenkins indicated that the issue
was brought before the City Council and they wanted the Park Board to
look at it a little further. Therefore, a subcommittee of the Park
Board was formed to prioritize the work and maintenance that needs to be
done. This subcommittee suggested that Braemar tennis courts be closed.
He indicated this recommendation was then brought before the City
Council and they voted 5 to 0 to close the Braemar tennis courts. Mr.
Jenkins then stated that we are now back looking at the issue again and
his feeling is that it's a hard decision to make, but feels they should
go along with the original decision that was made.
Mr. Coonrod pointed out that they went to the City Council and asked for
their consideration. The City Council said that he would need to have a
recommendation from the Park Board. Mr. Coonrod noted that they made a
plea to the City Council to reverse their decision with the caveat that
they would participate in the budgetary issue that they cited. He then
indicated that he respects this, but if you look at tearing out the
asset and the asset value, it's foolish not to preserve this if the
residents of the community are willing to participate at their own
expense. Mr. Coonrod pointed out that the people we are talking to are
significant tax payers. Mr. Coonrod feels it's an extraordinary
expression of interest in preserving this asset and if it isn't used
seven years from now then revisit the issue.
Mr. Coonrod stated that the other consideration is the city has spent
significant amounts of money to build a golf course and trails and the
tennis players should be given some priority. His concern is that
tennis is getting short -shifted.
Theodore Hansen asked if the Braemar tennis
that may be closed. Mr. Jenkins indicated
then asked why the Braemar tennis courts.
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courts are the only courts
that is correct. Mr. Hansen
Mr. Jenkins replied because
they are in the worst shape and would take the most money to get back
into shape. He then pointed out that there are still 42 tennis courts
left in the city.
Mr. Hansen then asked if Edina could have any lighted tennis courts. He
stated that Edina is one of the nicest communities and there are no
lighted tennis courts. Mr. Keprios indicated that lighted tennis courts
have not been a priority. Mr. Montgomery stated that having lights is a
very valid point and possibly we could put up lights for $7,000 to
$8,000. Mr. Keprios indicated that's a great idea if the resources are
available.
Mr. Coonrod pointed out that the reason they are in the worst shape is
because they haven't had any maintenance for seven years. Any court
could be in the worst shape if they haven't had any maintenance for
seven years. He noted that the staff needs to look at the maintenance
consideration so the courts don't get to where they cost $13,000 to
$14,000 to maintain. Mr. Jenkins indicated that it gets back to the
fixed amount of dollars that we have to work with. Mr. Coonrod then
stated that before you get into a $14,000 item maybe you should come to
the citizens so we don't find ourselves in this kind of a situation. He
pointed out that people in the community are willing to help if you will
accept it.
Mr. Dovolis stated that he would be willing to revisit the issue
because, any time you have interested citizens who are willing to donate
funding to recover an asset, the Park Board should take a hard look at
it and reevaluate the priorities. He indicated that we need to look at
all of our parks, they have been ignored for too long. Mr. Jenkins
stated that he would like to see a park bond referendum to bring all of
Edina's parks up to speed, but that is a whole separate issue.
Mr. Coonrod stated that it's important to recognize that the residents
are sincere and that he could possibly organize a greater effort than
the one in his letter. Mr. Jenkins noted that there is no question
about the sincerity and that the amount that they are talking about
really isn't going to make or break anything.
Mr. Montgomery stated that the Park Board should also discuss
alternative uses of the existing site. He stated that one of the most
popular sports going on right now for the youth is volleyball. He
pointed out that there is currently only one outdoor volleyball court
site. He feels that this would be an ideal location and that the sport
really attracts the 25 to 35 year olds.
Mr. Montgomery explained that the use of the tennis courts have been
hurt by the Northwest and Normandale clubs. He noted that these clubs
are giving away time during the summer. He indicated that the more
serious tennis players have elected to go indoors. Mr. Montgomery also
stated that the young kids who are trying to develop their tennis
abilities don't need to worry about whether there is a crack in the
court or if there are a few weeds growing.
Mr. Coonrod indicated that he is not interested in the 25 to 35 year
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olds. He stated that they are interested in the young kids who do not
have the money to pay for court time at the clubs. Mr. Fischer noted
that we have taken a small step toward enlisting the citizens in keeping
up the parks with the adopt -a -park program. He pointed out that the
citizens are contributing labor and time. He then stated that, when you
have citizens who are willing to put up money to save an asset, that
does change the equation.
Mr. Dow stated that, if the courts would have been maintained, we
wouldn't be here discussing this issue.
Mr. Herring asked if action needed to be taken now. Mr. Keprios
indicated that action can be delayed a month or two because work cannot
be done until spring. He stated that he has been directed not to take
the courts out because there has been community interest in saving the
Braemar tennis courts and a financial donation proposal in the making.
Gary Zachman indicated that he has taught for the Northwest Clubs for
years and has owned his own business and has made a living in the sport
for 20 years. He stated that if cosmetics is what the Park Board's
report is based on, then yes, the Braemar courts are probably in the
worst condition. However, structurally and dollar wise they are not the
worst tennis courts in Edina. Mr. Montgomery asked Mr. Zachman which
courts he thinks are the worst and he replied that he would have to
study it. Ms. Rydell asked Mr. Zachman if he looked at any of the other
courts and he replied that he did look at some. He then indicated that
the Highland tennis courts are in worse shape than Braemar. Mr.
Montgomery agreed that one court is in worse shape but that the other
court is still in good shape and therefore still stands behind his
decision. Mr. Zachman indicated that he is not arguing that, he is
arguing that Mr. Montgomery says the Braemar courts are in the worst
shape and his position is that they are not. Mr. Zachman stated that
there are some major problems that are very expensive at Highlands that
the Park Board might not be aware of.
Ms. Rydell stated that, when she and Mr. Montgomery did the report, they
were looking not as authorities on the subject. Mr. Zachman replied
that if Mr. Montgomery and Ms. Rydell are putting out a recommendation
on the position that the Braemar tennis courts are the worst tennis
courts in Edina then they are holding themselves as authorities.
Mr. Montgomery asked Mr. Zachman why he would say that the Highland
tennis courts are in worse shape than Braemar. Mr. Zachman replied that
structurally the sub -base on Highlands is shot and the concrete apron
under the fencing is shot. The Braemar courts have a concrete apron
under the fencing that does not have one crack in it. He pointed out
that you can't say that about several of the other facilities. He noted
that the Lake Cornelia courts have major problems but cosmetically
aren't as bad as the Braemar courts. Mr. Zachman then pointed out that
it's the young kids that we are worried about. He then stated that Mr.
Montgomery indicated that the high school has seven beautiful courts.
He noted that as an EGAA volunteer coach who plays there, they are not
beautiful courts. Mr. Montgomery then stated that the Lewis Park courts
and the Normandale courts are probably the best courts. Mr. Zachman
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then replied are we now talking about the best courts in Edina.
At this point Mr. Herring indicated to Chairman, Bill Jenkins, that he
is not going to sit here and let Mr. Montgomery and Ms. Rydell, who
volunteer their time, be subject to this kind of abuse. He stated that,
if the gentleman would like to ask questions, that would be fine. He
then indicated to Mr. Jenkins that Mr. Jenkins is the chairman and he
defers to him but he doesn't understand the point of this. He feels the
questions should be asked and then answered and the gentleman can
disagree, but it should be done in an orderly fashion.
Mr. Zachman indicated that he was just trying to clarify whether the
recommendation held and he said yes that those were the worst courts in
Edina and that's why they were the ones recommended to be torn out. Mr.
Montgomery noted that he thinks the recommendation is the cost to put
them in a quality shape was not dollars well spent. Mr. Zachman then
asked why were the Lewis Park tennis courts built so close to the
Braemar courts? They are not being maintained and there is an expense
right now to fix those.
Mr. Montgomery MOVED THAT THE PARK BOARD CONTINUE TO RECOMMEND THAT WE
REMOVE THE TENNIS COURTS AT BRAEMAR AS WE HAD RECOMMENDED AT THE JUNE
PARK BOARD MEETING. Andy Herring SECONDED THE MOTION. MOTION CARRIED 8
TO 1. John Dovolis was opposed.
Mr. Coonrod indicated to the Park Board that he is very disappointed in
their action and that the residents will continue their efforts.
III. 1995 FEES AND CHARGES
Mr. Keprios stated that Edinborough and Centennial Lakes are basically
recommending no increases in their fees and charges.
Mr. Keprios then explained that one of the fees that is being
recommended may be of a controversial nature. He explained that the
City Council has asked staff to come up with more creative ways to raise
revenues. Therefore, a $1.00 per participant administrative fee is
being recommended for youth athletic associations. This amount
basically will help cover a small percentage of the cost of advertising,
photocopying, mailing, scheduling, professional advisory staff time,
typing and handling of registrations. He noted that it doesn't even
come close to covering the out-of-pocket expense that the city incurs.
In fact, it only covers a very small percentage but it's a step in the
direction that he has been asked to take. He noted that this fee would
generate approximately $7,800 to $8,000 on an annual basis.
Mr. Crowther asked Mr. Keprios if he could define for him advisory
assistance. Mr. Keprios explained that a professional advisor is
assigned to each youth athletic association. The professional advisor
has been providing two basic services, scheduling and professional
advice. Mr. Keprios noted that the assigned staff tries to attend as
many meetings as possible. However, there are now 13 associations and
not enough staff to go around. Mr. Crowther stated that scheduling is
different from advisory assistance and he is curious how we define
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advisory assistance. Mr. Crowther indicated that he is concerned about
what he has seen in a number of the associations this year where he
feels there has been a lack of input or direction from the
professionals. This in turn makes the associations far less effective
and he feels that the public views it in that fashion as well. Mr.
Crowther then stated that he knows we do not run the boards and that
each association has a board. However, the general public doesn't
always realize this and therefore view it as a park and recreation
problem.
Mr. Keprios then explained that the staff does not have a vetoing vote,
however, the City does have control of the facilities that are owned by
the City. There are some groups that rely heavily on the staff's advice
and others who don't. Mr. Crowther then indicated that this is not a
fee and charge issue and asked to discuss it at the end of the meeting
under Other.
Mr. Herring indicated that it would be helpful to know the actual
administrative costs of services provided to these athletic associations
to help quantify those costs. Mr. Herring stated that it would be nice
as a selling tool to know what you those costs are and what this would
raise as far as revenues to support this fee. Mr. Keprios indicated
that it would be difficult to quantify the exact cost per association,
however, the staff would do their best to estimate an expense per
association. Mr. Keprios stated that it costs from one association to
another depending on how much work they rely on us to do. He pointed
out that some do their own mailings, scheduling, registrations and
typing, where other associations use some or all of those services at no
fee. Each association's request for services also varies slightly from
year to year. Mr. Herring asked if the associations are charged for
photocopying. Mr. Keprios indicated that they are not unless it is for
fund raising purposes, such as an invitational fund raiser tournament.
Mr. Montgomery noted that he would not be in favor of adding another
$1/participant fee for adult softball because the entire program is
organized and implemented by staff and their fees are already high
enough. Mr. Montgomery stated that he is against adding a buck to the
fees for any of these programs. Mr. Montgomery stated that he'd rather
see the dollar be raised for facility usage rather than administrative
costs.
Mr. Crowther stated that if you tell people you are going to charge them
$1.00 and part of what you are incorporating is the advisory assistance
you may have some associations saying that they are not getting their
moneys worth. Mr. Keprios explained that the direction is that if you
don't like the philosophical approach to it that's fine. He indicated
he really doesn't have a problem with it, he is just trying to
creatively raise additional revenue. Mr. Herring asked if the
associations would pass the expense on to the participant and it was
noted that they would.
Mr. Montgomery asked which association is the $6.00 fee being added to.
It was noted that the Hockey Association currently has not paid the
$6.00 usage fee. Mr. Keprios explained that the Hockey Association has
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never paid a maintenance fee for the use of outdoor rinks and this year
20 mite teams are being scheduled to play outdoor games and the other
teams are scheduled to have practices outside. Therefore, it seems only
logical to charge for outdoor ice since it is a city owned and
maintained facility.
Mr. Montgomery noted that thinks all of the other fees are reasonable
but he still stumbles on the $1.00 administrative fee. Mr. Keprios
indicated that in 1987 when the field usage fee first started it was
$5.00 and two years ago it was raised to $6.00. Mr. Jenkins noted that
we would pick up approximately $8,000 by adding the $1.00 administrative
fee and it was noted that is correct.
Mr. Montgomery asked about adult softball and Mr. Keprios indicated that
each team pays $100.00 toward a fee which is essentially a user fee. It
is based on an average roster size of approximately 16 players times the
$6/participant field usage fee, which is the same as the youth are
currently charged. He noted that they have also been charging the
outdoor bandy program a maintenance fee which also balances out to $6.00
per player. Mr. Keprios then indicated that the administration fee is a
new idea.
Mr. Herring asked if there is $2,100 worth of staff support for adult
softball. Mr. Keprios noted that he would say yes, it's an enormous
program that is completely run by the staff. Mr. Montgomery indicated
that it's a fairly healthy fee to play adult softball. Mr. Keprios
stated that $100.00 goes to the city and the rest is put back into the
program and not simply into the City's general fund.
Mr. Herring asked about raising the user fee to $7.00. Mr. Keprios
stated that it's been two years since their last raise and he thought it
would be wise to wait at least another year. Mr. Crowther indicated
that he doesn't think it's really going to matter what you call it;
people are going to look at it as raising the fee $1.00. Mr. Dovolis
indicated that he doesn't think the $1.00 fee is appropriate. He feels
that people will look at it as just another way of trying to gauge
something out of them. Mr. Dovolis indicated that he remembers how
people felt when the usage fee was started a few years ago. People
didn't feel they were getting their moneys worth. It was noted that it
just gets back to the big picture that we have a limited amount of money
to work with. Mr. Crowther indicated that these are again revenues that
the Park Department gets no benefit from, it goes right to City. Mr.
Keprios indicated that these revenues do not increase the Park
Department's expense budget; it basically helps offset existing
expenses. Mr. Crowther noted that it's hard to explain to people that
we need to offset these administrative costs yet the money really
doesn't flow to the department to offset those costs it just goes into
the overall city budget. Mr. Keprios then stated that one approach
might be to hold off this year and suggest we talk to the associations
and feed it to them slowly. It is difficult to charge for services that
have always been provided at no additional fee since they existed.
Mr. Dovolis asked Mr. Keprios about the associations who donate money
back to the Park Department. Mr. Keprios stated that most often the
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associations who donate money are the wealthiest ones and those who are
making money from city facilities, such as Hockey Moms who use the
Braemar Arena concession stand.
Mr. Crowther suggested looking at charging for the services and telling
the associations that the city can no longer afford to give free copies.
Mr. Keprios indicated that we have to be careful how we treat the
volunteers. They are a very big and important part of the Park and
Recreation Department and we don't want to give them the wrong message.
Mr. Jenkins then stated he doesn't think it's very good to charge
volunteers who are trying to assist staff. Mr. Crowther point6d out
that the problem is that some associations would be getting charged for
services that they are not using. He stated the concern that this new
fee may encourage associations to start using services that they
currently are not using and that would create a tremendous influx of
additional work on the staff. Mr. Crowther explained that you have to
look at all prospects. Mr. Keprios stated that if certain associations
are not using the services that chances are they would not be invoiced
the $1.00. Mr. Keprios then indicated that the staff needs to do a
better job to determine exactly who is getting what services, how much
the costs are and revisit the issue at another time. And therefore,
staff will provide an analysis of current services used by each
association and an estimated cost associated with those services and
give a report at the December Park Board meeting.
Mr. Herring indicated to Mr. Keprios that his personal view is you're on
the right track looking at different sources of revenue and he feels he
should continue to do that.
Mr. Montgomery MOVED TO ACCEPT THE FEES AND CHARGES EXCEPT FOR THE
ADMINISTRATIVE COSTS OF $1.00.
Mr. Herring then questioned why was the Normandale course charged $9.00
and $8.00 while the Braemar Executive Course charged only $7.50 and
$6.50. Mr. Valliere indicated that there are two issues involved, one
is cost and the other is debt service. He also stated that the
Normandale Golf Course is a lot longer than the Braemar Executive
Course.
Mr. Valliere explained that right now they are in the process of
planting trees to protect some of the areas that have been experiencing
a few stray golf balls that have subsequently caused damage. He also
noted that there is a large debt service at Normandale that they would
like to have the facility address. Mr. Valliere then stated that the
course has been well received and there have been no complaints about
the green fees.
Mr. Valliere indicated that Braemar was raised .50 and Normandale was
raised $1.00. Mr. Valliere indicated that the annual debt service at
Normandale golf course is the $117,000. The 1994 gross revenues are
slightly over $200,000, and the operating expenses were around $100,060.
He explained that if you add expenses and debt service you have a net
loss and he is trying to recover that as quickly as he can as well as
address the problem of stray golf balls.
Ms. Rydell asked if the Braemar Executive Golf Course could be raised
$1.00 instead of .50. Mr. Valliere indicated he would be open to that.
Mr. Dovolis asked Mr. Valliere if he has checked green fees with the
other areas golf courses. Mr. Valliere stated that Braemar is in the
middle. Mr. Valliere indicated that he feels there are a couple of
reasons we should go up. One is we are faced with debt service at this
given moment in time. He also believes that the fees should be cost
driven and not just profit motivated. Mr. Valliere then indicated if he
had opened the new nine hole course on time the revenues would have met
budgeted expectations. Unfortunately, the course opened later than
scheduled.
Mr. Valliere indicated that the budget for 1995 is $2,900,000 if all
goes well. He noted that the 1994 golf season had extremely good
weather. Mr. Dovolis asked compared to other courses where are we. Mr.
Valliere stated we're in a good situation, we are right there in the
middle or slightly above. Mr. Dovolis asked if there have been any
thoughts to increasing the fees in the prime times. Mr. Valliere stated
that this has been discussed and the thoughts are the golf course is
busy every day of the week and why should we particularly pick on the
weekend players. Mr. Valliere indicated that accounting wise it also
makes it a lot easier.
Ms. Rydell asked why is there only a $50.00 difference between residents
and non-residents for the Braemar Room. She asked if we would lose a
lot of people if that fee were raised. Mr. Valliere indicated that the
$650.00 price is where we should be, it is what the market will bear.
Mr. Valliere indicated that he would not advocate raising the $650.00
because we would lose people.
Mr. Herring asked about the locker fees. Mr. Valliere indicated that's
a fee based on supply and demand. In 1994, we actually saw some
decrease in the sale of the lockers so I would like to correct that
problem.
Jean Rydell MOVED TO AMEND THE PREVIOUS MOTION TO ALSO RAISE THE FEE AT
BRAEMAR EXECUTIVE GOLF COURSE FROM $7.50 TO $8.00 FOR ADULT NON -PATRONS
AND FROM $6.50 TO $7.00 FOR ADULT PATRONS. Andrew Herring SECONDED THE
MOTION. AMENDMENT CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
Dave Crowther SECONDED THE ORIGINAL MOTION WITH THE AMENDMENT TO READ
MOVE TO RECOMMEND TO THE CITY COUNCIL TO ACCEPT THE FEES AND CHARGES
WITH THE EXCEPTION TO NOT CHARGE A $1.00 ADMINISTRATIVE FEE TO THE YOUTH
ATHLETIC ASSOCIATIONS AND TO RAISE THE BRAEMAR EXECUTIVE GOLF COURSE FEE
FROM $7.50 TO $8.00 FOR ADULT NON -PATRONS AND FROM $6.50 TO $7.00 FOR
ADULT PATRONS. MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
IV. OTHER
A. Athletic Associations -Mr. Crowther indicated that this is a
topic that should probably be brought up at a different Park Board
meeting but noted that he would like to bring up a couple of points. He
stated that he is confused and concerned about what support our staff
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gives to the associations and how these associations function in the
community. He asked if the Park Board cares if they are effective or
not and if they do a good job or not. He gave a few examples of what
has been happening in the EGAA program and in the football program.
Mr. Crowther explained how the EGAA girls basketball and the traveling
girls basketball do not work together and the girls were fighting
against each other as to who gets what players. He indicated it was a
mess. Also, the scheduling was not very good. There were about five or
six different changes. House basketball was scheduled against flag
football and then the playoffs had to be rescheduled. Mr. Crowther
stated there was total confusion and that was the staff who did that and
not EGAA. Mr. Crowther brought up the point that girls flag football
cost $35.00 for three games and girls house basketball cost $35.00 for
15 games. He stated that things like that show how out of control
things are. Mr. Crowther asked should staff be concerned about this or
should they just let each board run their own program and we will just
give them the facility. Mr. Crowther feels that the staff needs to
better define what their role is with the associations.
Mr. Crowther also indicated that football this year for the boys was
terrible. They had all sorts of problems and part of it was continuity.
He again asked should staff be concerned about continuity and help the
associations or do they just let them flounder. Mr. Crowther indicated
that other associations have similar problems but these are two who have
had problems within the last three months. He noted that there is a
concern among people and should we be concerned or should we divorce
ourselves from these things. He noted that we are putting ourselves
out as offering these associations professional help and services but he
feels they are not getting that.
Ms. Bennett indicated that she had concerns about some of the football
coaches this year and wanted to know how that process works. She
indicated that she knows they are volunteers but there were huge
differences in the teams in regards to coaching. She indicated that
maybe there should be some type of requirement or at least be
knowledgeable about the game. Mr. Jenkins noted that what happens is
the Football Association gets a coordinator for a particular grade level
and then the coordinator tries to find the best qualified person they
can to coach. He noted that you do get a lot of different level guys and
each year is a little bit different.
Mr. Crowther stated that his feeling is that, if we have an association
that's struggling, our professional staff should really be digging in
and helping that association. He indicated that, if we are not going to
give them help, then maybe we should just let them go and do their own
thing and we can save expenses. However, we have these associations and
if there are too many associations to manage them, we need to find a way
to manage them so that staff can work fairly with all of these
associations. He indicated that certainly if some of the associations
have problems, and there are some obvious situations that you know are
crying out for help, lets give them the help. He indicated that he
doesn't see that happening. Mr. Crowther then stated that he thinks the
public views this as a Park and Recreation problem and not an EGAA
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problem or an Edina Football problem.
Mr. Keprios replied that in regards to the scheduling confusion with
EGAA this year, yes it was a staff error. He explained that with the
transition that the staff has been going through there have been some
duties shifted around. He pointed out that this year they had Ann
Kattreh from Edinborough work with EGAA and have found out that for a
variety of reasons it hasn't worked. He stated that it is not a
criticism of Ms. Kattreh, it's that by virtue of location of offices and
being short one full-time Recreation Supervisor position for 6 months,
there was not enough communication, guidance and supervisory assistance
for Ann to learn all the variables and details of the job. Mr. Keprios
noted that he partially blames himself for not having or taking more
time to train her in. Also, staff has learned that it is important to
keep the master schedule for reserved gym space at City Hall and that
all the staff who use this master schedule should be located at City
Hall.
Mr. Keprios then indicated that in answer to Mr. Crowther's question
should staff be the answers to all of athletic associations problems.
No, staff cannot be to all of their meetings and we are looking at other
alternatives on how to best serve them when they do need help. He
pointed out that these volunteer youth athletic associations are always
going to have problems. Mr. Crowther indicated that in a lot of cases
you can see when some things are going wrong. He noted that he is not
saying you have to be all these things to all these people, that's not
the point. He's saying that we have to be involved when there's a need
to be involved. He explained that it wasn't two weeks into the football
season when people were telling him things were going array.
Mr. Keprios asked Chairman Jenkins, who also currently serves as a
football board member, if he is familiar with the problems that Mr.
Crowther is referring to in regards to football. Mr. Jenkins noted that
basically the problem was the board decided to let the boys in grades
6th, 7th and 8th play in the Lake Minnetonka conference. Therefore,
they took care of all of the scheduling. He indicated that the
scheduling with all four different communities, which was handled by
volunteers, got mixed up. He stated that next year it could be done a
lot better.
Mr. Crowther explained how this year there weren't any lights on at
Lewis Park for the first game. Mr. Keprios indicated that he ended up
turning the lights on that night himself because luckily he happened to
be driving by the park that evening. He stated that when he talked to
Mr. MacHolda the next day he found out that it was not a staff mistake,
it was a board mistake. Mr. Keprios then went on to say that he thinks
the residents' perception is that staff doesn't care and we are the
creation of all of the problems, however, that's not accurate. He
indicated that he will take responsibility for the EGAA scheduling
errors in EGAA basketball and will take the necessary steps to correct
future problems.
Mr. MacHolda indicated that with the Lewis Park incident he told the
Football Board that they need to accept the responsibility to turn on
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the field lights for their scheduled games. Therefore, Joe Engels, a
football board member, received five keys for Lewis Park. Mr. Crowther
replied to Mr. MacHolda that he is missing the point, he's not blaming
anyone for the wrong schedule or the fact that lights didn't get turned
on. He's saying some of the associations are screwed up and we don't
seem to care about it. Mr. MacHolda then stated that in reality, staff
has very little control over these youth athletic associations. Mr.
Keprios stated that Mr. Crowther brings out some really good points and
would ask that we put this as an agenda item at the next meeting. Mr.
Keprios noted that the staff will prepare a report for this subject
because he thinks it's definitely worthy of further discussion. Mr.
Keprios then stated that this may be a good time to maybe reconsider
what role the staff should play in serving the youth athletic
associations.
Ms. Bennett asked if the Park Board ever receives minutes from the Swim
Club. Mr. Keprios indicated that whatever minutes are given to the Park
and Recreation Department we copy and give to the Park Board.
Mr. Dovolis indicated that he'was involved in football for 14 years and
he received phone calls from people who said it was the worst year ever.
Mr. MacHolda indicated that part of the reason may be that they had a
new president who wasn't around much because he received a job
promotion. Also, you have board members who are coaches, commissioners,
parents and professionals and they can't get it all done. He also went
on to say that football is the smallest program and to go outside of the
community might have added to it. He pointed out that football has 400
kids while soccer has 2,000 kids and not a glitch. Mr. Jenkins stated
that the football board problem is a football board problem not a park
and recreation staff problem. Mr. Dovolis indicated that he realizes
that but if the program seems to be having difficulty is that a Park
Board problem or is it a Park and Recreation problem. This topic will
be on the next Park Board agenda.
B. Baseball - Mr. Herring indicated that he has been contacted by a
participant in the baseball program who is concerned about competition
and coach favoritism. He indicated that at the next meeting he will
pass along to the Park Board members the memo that he received.
C. Mac Thayer - Mr. Keprios indicated that the Park Board, City
Council and Staff sent a beautiful bouquet of flowers when Mac Thayer
passed away. It was noted that Mac made significant contributions to
the Edina Park Board and he will be dearly missed.
D. Bob Kojetin Park - Mr. Keprios sent around the picture album of
Bob's retirement party. He indicated that the park identification sign
will be put in next week. However, the dedication will be held in the
spring.
E. Senior Advisory Task Force - Mr. Keprios indicated that the Senior
Advisory Task Force have indicated that they need a representative from
the Park Board, preferably someone of a baby.boomer age, to serve on
their committee. This group is looking at the long range plans of the
Senior Center and meeting the needs of Edina's senior population in the
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future. The Senior Center lease at the Community Center runs out in the
year 2000.
V. ADJOURNMENT
Dave Crowther MOVED TO ADJOURN THE MEETING AT 9:20 P.M. John Dovolis
SECONDED THE MOTION. MEETING ADJOURNED.
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