HomeMy WebLinkAbout1991-09-10 Park Board MinutesEDINA PARK BOARD
7:30 p.m.
September 10, 1991
MANAGER'S CONFERENCE ROOM
MEMBERS PRESENT: Bob Christianson, Beth Hall, Pat Vagnoni, Mac Thayer,
James Fee, Chip Sour, Bill Jenkins, Andy Montgomery
Jean Rydell, Paul O'Connor
MEMBERS ABSENT: Bill Lord
STAFF PRESENT: Bob Kojetin, John Keprios, John Valliere, Janet Canton
OTHERS PRESENT: Jenny Black, Roger Harold
I. APPROVAL OF THE AUGUST 13 1991 MINUTES
Jean Rydell MOVED TO APPROVE THE AUGUST 13, 1991•MINUTES. Mac Thayer
SECONDED THE MOTION. MINUTES APPROVED.
II. NORMANDALE GOLF COURSE
Mr. Christianson stated that at last month's Park Board meeting Ken Rosland
gave a presentation to the Park Board regarding Normandale Golf Course.
Mr. Rosland was going to be giving the same presentation to the surrounding
neighborhood and to the Planning Commission. Mr. Rosland asked the Park
Board at last months meeting to have a recommendation ready to give to the
City Council at the September 23, 1991 City Council meeting.
Mr. Kojetin informed the Park Board of what has happened since the last
Park Board meeting. Mr. Rosland did meet with the surrounding neighborhood
at a neighbors home who overlooks the golf course. The neighborhoods
biggest concerns centered around the office building that would one day be
built on the six acres. Right now the proposed building would be 5
stories, similar to the medical building at Centennial Lakes. Mr. Kojetin
stated that the neighborhood people also attended the Planning Commission
meeting. There were about 150 people who attended this meeting. The major
focus was on the proposed building. Some of the neighbors are in favor of
the golf course and like the lay out and some of them are not. There were
a few concerns on hole #7 which would hit towards some of the homes. One
person indicated they used the tennis courts all of the time and were
against them being removed, they felt that Cornelia School was too far to
go. Some people would also like to see the softball fields remain there.
It was decided that the Planning Commission would authorize a 4 story
building on the designated 6 acres. This was not a 1008 vote in favor to
recommend to the City Council. Mr. Kojetin also indicated they do not know
if Opus would accept a four story building or not.
Mr. Christianson stated that it is the Park Board's task to recommend to
the City Council whether or not they want to proceed with the purchase of
Normandaie Golf Course and on what terms. Mr. Christianson stated that it
is the staff's recommendation in the special report that the City purchase
the 22 acres for the development of the golf course. Mr. Christianson
suggested to the Park Board that everyone voice their concerns and after
fully discussing the issue, a recommendation should be made to the City
Council.
Andrew Montgomery - He has no problem with the golf course. He also has no
problem with the tennis courts being taken out. They are in poor shape and
they are not used very often. Also, the Cornelia School tennis courts are
not very far away. Mr. Montgomery did state that he has a problem with the
three softball fields being eliminated. The adult softball program has
been growing and since Van Valkenburg has been built the neighborhood
fields at Todd, Yorktown and Highlands have been eliminated. The fields at
Lake Edina have been used very heavily. Mr. Keprios did note that because
of Van Valkenburg, other ball fields have been used for other
organizations
Jean Rydell - She asked if the ball fields could still be kept? It was
noted that they could not. The space was needed in order to build a
competitive and playable course. Mr. Kojetin stated the way the plan is
now there is no way the fields could be saved. Mr. Christianson asked if
the golf course could be shorter? Mr. Valliere stated that it really could
not, it is already fairly small and the intent is to make it larger to
recapture more revenue. With an executive course it will allow $2.00 to
$3.00 more per round. Ms. Rydell stated she has no problem with the tennis
courts being taken out. Ms. Rydell also asked if it was worth it to give
up the softball fields? Mr. Kojetin stated that he feels it would be worth
it.
Mr. Keprios noted that this year there were 132 teams and last year there
were 119 teams. It is the co-rec league that is growing. Mr. Jenkins
asked if some of the neighborhood parks including Lake Edina were
envisioned as closing when Van Valkenburg was built? It was noted that the
Lake Edina fields have bad soil conditions and at some point in time the
fields would need to be excavated and leveled out and preferably install a
fabric under the soil to stabilize the playing field. It was also noted
that if we lose the Lake Edina fields we will need to go back to the
neighborhood parks or limit the number of teams in the program.
James Fee - He is comfortable with reallocating the softball fields. He
also thinks the golf course is a good proposal and will get a lot of use.
However, money should be allocated to build another softball field.
Chip Sour - He likes the design very much. He especially likes the two pin
placement. He is also okay with the tennis courts being taken out.
Paul O'Connor - He is very supportive of the golf course. This would make
the sport of golf more available to all residents. Mr. O'Connor stated
that he presently uses the Lake Edina tennis courts and would not have a
problem using the courts at Cornelia. School.. He. has rarely seen anyone
using the courts at Lake Edina Park.
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Mac Thayer He likes the proposal.
Beth Hall - She likes it, but is concerned about the softball fields.
There should be a replacement to these fields, however, this should not
hold up the golf course.
Pat Vagnoni - She asked how people in the neighborhood feel about
everything being taken away from them? Do these people feel comfortable
with the new facility. Mr. Kojetin indicated they are mostly positive and
they will be getting new playground equipment at another location. She
also asked if there are young families in the neighborhood? It was noted
that there are.
Bill Jenkins - He is in favor of the golf course. The softball fields,
however, will need to be relocated. Overall he thinks it is a good idea.
Bob Christianson - He conceptually has no problem with the tennis courts
being taken out. He is concerned about the softball fields. If the
program is showing an increase in the number of participants adequate
provisions need to be made. He would also like to know what the proposed
golf course is going to be as well as the developer's cost. He is
concerned about the $700,000 redevelopment of the golf course. There are
three golf courses in one with the different pin and tee placements. He
would like to know what the breakdown of the costs are. Mr. Christianson
felt this is a Rolls Royce Golf Course and does Edina really need one? He
feels it does not. Mr. Christianson noted he is in favor of having a golf
course and having it be executive length, but not to the extent as
planned. After a quick calculation he figured this way there could be a
profit long before what the report shows. He is very concerned about the
cost. He is in support of the golf course, but not in the context it is
being presented with an elaborate 2 pin placement course. Mr. Kojetin
noted they have not been given the breakdown of numbers.
Bob Kojetin - Personally he feels the 22 acres should be in public
ownership. As far as the golf course, there are 30 plus parks in the city
and if there can be a charge for recreational activities to help maintain
the park land, this would be good as we look to the future. A lot of
revenue is received from this sport across the country. Mr. Kojetin also
noted that corporate league play is a need in the community and this would
be a good course for it.
Mr. Kojetin noted that a fabric needs to be put on the fairways and greens
throughout the course because of poor soil conditions. Mr. Kojetin also
stated that everyone suggested and brought up good points. At the present
time the architect was not given the directions to break down the cost of
the development of the course. He just rounded the figure to $75,000 per
hole which would be a reasonable cost for the re -development of the
Normandale Golf Course. Once the property is purchased then there will be
a further break down of costs and development with the architect for the
golf course.
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Roger Harold, member of the Braemar Golf Association, has seen
approximately 80 courses with this same type of concept with different pin
and tee placements. It creates more of a feeling of an 18 hole course.
Mr. Kojetin noted that the USGA rules show that it would cost about
$100,000 a hole but this figure has been cut to $75,000 per hole. It is
not a long course and this is felt to be a reasonable number. The
architect has also used this number.
Mr. Christianson asked why we are doing this? Is it a course for the
championship golfer, the casual golfer, or the just starting out golfer?
Just what is the purpose of the golf course's complexity?
Mr. Christianson noted if we accept the concept and have any concerns and
thoughts, they should be expressed at this point so that the City Council
can see them.
It was asked if there is a deadline on acquiring the property? Mr. Kojetin
stated that the Rauenhorst family would like to sell this fall. If the
City acquires it, then the plans and specs would be started. The golf
course could open sometime in 1993.
Chip Sour MOVED TO RECOMMEND TO THE CITY COUNCIL THAT THE CITY:
1. ACQUIRE THE 22 ACRES AS PUBLIC LAND AND DEVELOP IT AS A GOLF COURSE.
2. HAVE THE STAFF OR ARCHITECT MAKE AN EVALUATION OF THE $700,000 CONSTRUCTION
COST OF THE GOLF COURSE. THE PARK BOARD QUESTIONS THE PROPOSED COSTS FOR
THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE GOLF COURSE IF IT COULD BE DONE FOR LESS.
3. IF LAKE EDINA PARK IS USED AS PART OF THE TOTAL GOLF COURSE EXPANSION:
a. ELIMINATE THE SOFTBALL FIELDS BUT PROVIDE FUNDING FOR A REPLACEMENT
FIELD WITHIN THE PARK SYSTEM.
b. PLAYGROUND EQUIPMENT FACILITY BE INCORPORATED AS RECOMMENDED BY THE
PLAN BUT PROVIDE FUNDING.
C. ELIMINATE TENNIS COURTS BUT PROVIDE AREA FOR FUTURE POSSIBLE
DEVELOPMENT.,.
Paul O'Connor SECONDED THE MOTION. MOTION CARRIED.
III. EDINA BASKETBALL ASSOCIATION - MIKE BURLEY, PRESIDENT
Mr. Burley did not attend the Park Board meeting.
IV. BRYANT LAKE REGIONAL PARK
Mr. Kojetin indicated to the Park Board that Joan Lonsbury is on the
Metropolitan Open Space Committee in.allocation of funding for parks. She
gave a presentation at the City Council meeting and also wanted the Park
Board to hear her request. She is looking for endorsements from Edina, St.
Louis Park, Eden Prairie, Bloomington and Richfield for funding from the
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state to the southern parks in Hennepin County. The majority of money the
past few years has always been spent on the parks in the northern part of
Hennepin County. Ms. Lonsbury would like to see Bryant Lake Regional Park
receive funding first this year. This area has a lot to offer, boating, a
picnic area, swimming, bike trails, walking trails, etc. Her concern is to
get some proclamation, endorse her when she discusses this topic at the
next Metropolitan Open Space Committee meeting. Mr. Kojetin noted that we
should start using the county parks more. We do have the disadvantage that
there is not a Hennepin County park in our community.
Pat Vagnoni MOVED TO SUPPORT JOAN LONSBURY AND THE CITY COUNCIL'S
RESOLUTION TO HAVE MORE FUNDING ALLOCATED TO SOUTHERN HENNEPIN COUNTY AND
BRYANT LAKE REGIONAL PARK. Mac Thayer SECONDED THE MOTION. MOTION
CARRIED.
V. OTHER
A. Tennis Courts - Mr. Montgomery took it upon himself to visit all 16
tennis court sites and wrote a report on the condition of each of these
courts. (See attached). Mr. Montgomery noted that there does seem to be a
decline in the number of people playing tennis on the city courts. This
lead Mr. Montgomery to conclude that spending major dollars on the
resurfacing of Edina Park tennis courts may not seem to be a reasonable use
of taxpayer dollars. He also noted that to let them become eyesores and a
source of neighborhood complaints is also not in the city's best interest.
Mr. Montgomery also felt that the patching technique is an alternative but
it has the appearance of being repaired rather than resurfaced. The courts
that have been most recently resurfaced have not lasted. He feels we need
a better understanding of what we are purchasing and what guarantees we can
expect regarding a court life. He noted that the Community Center and High
School courts which were resurfaced this year are excellent and he would
expect they will last for 5-8 years before being resurfaced again. Mr.
Montgomery also noted that he does not understand why resurfacing is done
in September when there is limited outdoor playing time remaining.
Mr. Keprios noted that through the years they have found there are no
experts in this area. Mr. Keprios indicated that the Edina School District
has been using an engineering firm called Inspec to evaluate their tennis
courts and parking lots. 'Mr. Keprios has been working closely with this
company since March of this year to determine the most cost effective means
of maintaining the tennis courts. After reviewing several different
proposals, it was decided that we could only afford to do effective
maintenance on three sets of courts, Normandale, Countryside and Creek
Valley. This is a very tough decision to make as to which courts get done
first. Decisions on which courts are in most need of maintenance are made
in the Spring of the year because the majority of the damage to the tennis
courts and hard surface areas occurs during the Winter months. The money
allocated to maintain tennis courts and hard surface courts is the same
fund in the budget to repair and install playground equipment. There is a
very limited -amount of money to do playground equipment, hard surface
courts and tennis courts and we are thus faced with difficult decisions
when you are dealing with all kinds of complaints. We will be faced with
very difficult decisions next year again because there are five of Edina's
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six hard surface play areas (basketball, four square, hop scotch, etc.)
that need major repair as well as tennis courts in need of maintenance and
playground equipment that needs repair or replacement.
Mr. Montgomery also brought up the point that he feels each Park Board
member should be assigned responsibility for a periodic review and comment
on 4 - 5 parks of the 37 park facilities that are offered to the Edina
public. Ms. Rydell asked if the park assignments could be changed around
from time to time so the board members could see different parks.
Mr. Kojetin noted that the staff is in the process right now of using a
telephone message center service for this reason. Whenever a staff person
sees something that needs to be done they call it in. Then, every morning
Solvei, the office coordinator, will play the tape and give the list to
Vince Cockriel, the park foreman. Mr. Kojetin also pointed out that the
Park Board will sometimes look at things differently then the staff. Mr.
Montgomery will have a list at the next Park Board meeting with all of the
Board members assigned parks.
B. Intern - Mr. Keprios introduced Jenny Black. She will be working with
Mr. Keprios as an intern. She is a student at Mankato State University.
C. Chowen Park - Mr. Keprios indicated that the old equipment from Chowen
Park was donated to a church. He passed around photographs of what they
did with the equipment. The Richfield church named their new playground
site "Charlies' Playground", named after a soldier who died in Desert
Storm.
D. Sherwood Park - Mr. Keprios informed the Park Board that they will be
receiving a petition at next month's meeting from the neighbors by Sherwood
Park. They would like to have an ice skating rink there this winter.
E. Braemar Golf Association Board - Mr. Christianson informed the Park
Board that he received a letter from the Braemar Golf Association Board.
The letter indicated that they have over 600 due paying members and they
have voted unanimously to approve the Park Board and City Hall efforts to
pursue approval of the new nine hole course within the Braemar environs.
VI. ADJOURNMENT
Beth Hall MOVED TO ADJOURN THE MEETING AT 8:55 P.M. Mac Thayer SECONDED
THE MOTION. MEETING ADJOURNED.
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