Loading...
HomeMy WebLinkAbout1986-06-10 Park Board MinutesEDINA PARK BOARD JUNE 10, 1986 7:30 P.M. ?DINA CITY HALL MEMBERS PRESENT: Joan Lonsbury, George Warner, Don Wineberg, Marilyn Wooldridge, Andy Montgomery, Bob Christianson, Bill Lord, Jim Fee, Jean Rydell, Mack Thayer STAFF PRESENT: Bob Kojetin, John Keprios, Ed MacHolda, Madelyn Krinke I. APPROVAL OF MINUTES OF MAY 13, 1986 MEETING Don Wineberg moved to approve minutes of the May 13, 1986 meeting. Andy Montgomery seconded the motion. Motion passed. II. NORMANDALE PARK Bob Kojetin explained that the Park Board looks at the total development of the Park and Recreation system. He listed the many factors which have gone into proposing any changes for Normandale Park. -Fifteen years ago was the last time any rearranging or grading was done at Normandale Park. We look at park planning in a 20 year phase, so now we are trying to bring Normandale Park up to date. -The Park and Recreation Department staff prepares information on the total programs and looks at what will be happening and tries -to evaluate if the current park is being most efficiently run as it is or if it should be changed. -The trend in hockey has been that the number of participants has gone down and more of the playing time is indoors. We have closed three rinks, but still have ten open. The question which must be answered is if the statistics indicate how many rinks should be left open or closed. It costs about $10,000 per year to maintain a hockey rink. Eight hours of maintaining ice during the day is often worthless when severe cold weather conditions occur or it snows in the evening before the rink can be used. -Mr. Kojetin showed a city map indicating how many areas overlap within a 3/4 mile radius which is usually used as a guideline for how far rinks should be apart. Normandale sits right in the middle of all the other city rinks. -The Park Board looks at whether there is a strong interest in the community for use of a facility when deciding what to do with a park. -This year there is $50,000 budgeted for improvements at Normandale Park. Of that money, a minimum of $15,000 is needed to replace all the playground equipment. The old equipment will have to be torn out. -The hockey rink needs to be replaced if it is going to be used next year. The boards alone will cost $10,000 so the question which must be answered is whether or not to put the money into upgrading the hockey rink or should it be removed and the area used for soccer/football fields. -Soccer has been growing in numbers and two additional small soccer fields are needed, especially since now the program includes 1st and 2nd graders. -The jugs program was discontinued at Normandale because there were not enough children in that area who signed up for that park. 1 -There is a nice warming house at Normandale which should be used more in the summer for playground activities and would also be available for soccer players. The Park Board is looking to the community for input. Joan Lonsbury invited discussion by the visitors. Tom Hardie, 5309 Whiting, was the first to speak. Mr. Hardie stated that he felt that the statistics compiled by the warming house attendants were not entirely accurate or complete. He said that often coaches had to take their teams to other parks to practice because Normandale was being used for broomball. He said he has used Normandale extensively over the past few years and it is one of the better locations, especially because of the natural protection from the wind because it is surrounded by hills. Also, Mr. Hardie said Normandale is in an area surrounded by houses, unlike Countryside rink which is bounded by a fire station, a church and not many houses surrounding it. Mr. Hardie asked where the children would be expected to go for skating if Normandale is closed. He feels the number of children around Normandale Park is increasing because a lot of young families have moved into the neighborhood in the last year or two. Nancy Atchison asked if a general skating area would be left and commented that a lot of people, including herself, enjoy figure skating and general skating at Normandale. Bob Kojetin indicated that there could be a recreational skating rink there. Ron Couch expressed his concern about a change in traffic patterns if soccer fields were built, particularly around Warren Ave. and 66th Street. He inquired about the methodology of obtaining statistics : rink attendant may not be the best way of evaluating it. Why take away a rink where you have a natural setting with a wind barrier? Don Wineberg stated that he agreed that the method was relative and may seem unprofessional, but it is done the same at every park. Rick Nelson, 5204 Danens Dr., said he felt a park should be available for unorganized sports and soccer fields would not be used for anything other than soccer. As it is now the park can be used for playing baseball and hockey anytime without being organized. Karen Busch, 5229 Duggan Pl., commented that she saw a group of 26 youngsters who had just gotten together informally for a baseball game and thought it was a good opportunity for neighborhood youth and would not want to see the park changed to prevent that type of activity from taking place. Ms. Busch also pointed out that a number of retired persons have moved and there are at least 14 children who have come into the neighborhood in the last year and a half. She also asked where parents could send their elementary children to skate that they would not have to cross main roads if Normandale were not available. Darcy Szarzynski, 6616 Naomi, said that the demographics are changing drastically and his family uses the park daily. He would not like to see a soccer field there, but would like a new rink. Chuck DeVries, 6405 Ridgeview Dr., commended the Board for expanding soccer, but was wondering about the demographics for the year 2000? Bob Christianson indicated that the projections are not always entirely correct, but that there are plans to again use Highland School in 1990. 2 Tom Skala, 5313 Whiting, stated that Normandale Park has not been used for Jug ball for a couple of years because the numbers were down, however it may be needed again next year because of the number of youngsters who are in that area again. Another consideration for leaving a hockey rink at Normandale is that youngsters are not able to ride a bike to Countryside for hockey because of the cold weather, however they can bike there in the summer for Jugs. Karen Busch asked where money comes from for the parks and how we can get more money for the park. Bob Kojetin explained how money is budgeted for the parks and each year for upkeep of parks. Karen Busch asked if there would be some way of getting more money to operate the parks. Bob Christianson said there are only so many dollars to go around. If citizens of the city want more for parks, it would probably require raising taxes. Bob Price, 6412 Rolf, asked whether the liquor store profits are used for revenue. Bob Kojetin replied that about $300,000 is used to subsidize parks. The rest goes into the general fund. Mr. Kojetin stated that since 1962 the Park and Recreation Department has received $80,000 a year for capital improvements from the liquor store profits. Holly Knutson said there was always someone on the rink, however the big rink is not used that much. Doris Underwood said she hoped that money would be put into the hockey rink, not into a soccer field. She does not want to see groups of older youth coming there to play soccer. One member of the audience thought that putting in a soccer field would restrict free play at the park because there would be too much organized soccer being played there and the soccer fields would take away a lot of space for general use. Rich Novak, Ridgeview Dr., stated that the topography of the park is very important near the fields and asked when the playground equipment would be put in. Bob Kojetin replied that the equipment would be replaced this year. Mr. Zamanski, 5041 W. 66th, said the Park Board should look at the crowd present as a complement, they have done a great job. That is why people came to keep the park as it is. He further stated that the hill is a natural boundary and provides isolation and protection from the weather. Dana Arnold, 6341 Mildred Ave., said that a lot of times rink attendants were not present when skaters were using the rinks. Also the ice was not maintained to the end of February. Pat Kasper, 6608 Naomi Dr., expressed concern about parking problems. Bob Kojetin said that had not been considered yet. Mr. Kojetin further said he felt that a soccer field would also provide a free play area, but whether or not a soccer field is built at Normandale, the area would be upgraded to make a better area. A concern was expressed about how the topography would be changed. Bob Kojetin replied that no real change would take place. Ms. Faulkner, 5213 Danens Dr., asked if the baseball field would be removed if a soccer field is put in. She would like to see a balance of opportunities for the neighborhood. 3 Rick Oftel, 6400 Warren Ave., asked if the hockey rink is closed will that preclude the other rink and would the lights be turned off then also? Mr. Oftel said the lights are needed for sliding on the hills also. He feels Normandale is one of the nicest parks in the city. Park Board members spoke to the issue: Bill Lord said he would be in favor of keeping the Normandale Park as it is, Bob Christianson thought it would be better not to close the hockey rink at this time - look at other areas that are questionable, have to have more information; Mack Thayer commented that it seems the interest is strong for keeping the rinks; Andy Montgomery said he leans toward the neighborhood park concept; Marilyn Wooldridge said because it is so isolated and children would have to cross highways to go to another park she would favor leaving the hockey rink; Don Wineberg felt that if the need exists for the soccer fields, he did not see why it would be so bad to do so; George Warner agreed it is a little premature to make any alterations of the park, and would like to keep it much the way it is. John Keprios remarked that it was good to hear all the comments from the neighbors of the park and said that in making decisions about the parks, the needs of the programs in the entire city must be taken into account, and at some time in the future the neighbors of Normandale Park might have to be asked to understand the needs for the entire city's recreational needs. Bob Kojetin expressed his appreciation also for the response from the community on what direction to go. Mr. Kojetin explained the reason Normandale rink was closed before some of the others is because the ice begins to melt there earlier because the rink is built on peat and also because of the East-West orientation of the rink.. One of the recommendations is to raise the level of the hockey rink up 2 -3' higher to have better soil and not such a deep slope from the building to the rink. Bob Kojetin stated it would be his opinion that the park should remain as is, but be upgraded because of the comments from the neighbors. Joan Lonsbury thanked all the neighbors for coming to the meeting and for their concern for the neighborhood park. III. HISTORICAL PARK PRESENTATION Jim Finlayson, President of the Edina Historical Society, stated that there are many programs planned for the coming year. Donna Skagerberg elaborated on some of the activities being planned and reported on some that have been successful in the past. Donna stated the purpose of the Historical Society is to gather and provide historical information for this community, and since Wooddale School has been gone the society has been short of space to perform these functions. Much more space is needed to allow for research, genealogy searches, displaying of about 5,000 items now in their collection. A goal of the Historical Society is to reflect on the past 100 years of history of the community, and to look forward to dedicating efforts to strengthen the community for another 100 years. Mr. Finlayson reported that the Historical Board has endorsed the study which was done by Miller-Dunwiddie. The plan is to leave the Grange Hall and school at Tupa Park. The proposal is for a new building at Utley Park. John Keprios noted that the drawings show the building located where the tennis courts are now and asked if that is the only spot where the building could be built. 4 There was discussion about the possibility of using the Parbury property for the new building site. Foster Dunwiddie noted that it is not a prime location for a Historical building and Utley Park would be far more suitable because it is located on such a busy street. Bob Christianson expressed a concern about making any change in the Wooddale/Utley Parks since plans at those parks were thoroughly discussed with the neighbors last year and the Park Board made a firm recommendation and commitment to a plan which was agreed upon with the neighbors of that area. Joan Lonsbury questioned whether Arneson Acres could be used for the Historical Society site, as it seems to be a good location on a busy street, easy access from a main highway; it has a parking area, and building space already available which could possibly be expanded. It would also be compatible with the Garden Clubs. Foster Dunwiddie replied that he thought it was not available because of the terms of the conveyance of the property to the city. Several other Park Board members agreed that they thought Arneson Acres seemed like a good location for the Historical Society to consider. Glenn Smith interjected that the group was looking for the best possible location and had come up with Utley Park, but they would be willing to reconsider the location if Arneson Acres is in fact a possibility. Bob Christianson asked whether additional parking spaces would be needed if the new building was built in Utley Park. Foster Dunwiddie did not think there would be a need for more parking. Funding was discussed briefly. The proposal as presented would cost about $440,000. The annual operating cost is anticipated to be $12,000. The Study Committee has investigated methods of funding, and project that they might be able to raise most of the funds necessary for construction and would hope to set up an endowment fund for upkeep. Further comments by Park Board members were made. Jean Rydell, Jim Fee and Bill Lord all agreed that if Arneson Acres is available it should be considered. Bob Christianson voiced opposition to taking away any more green area from parks, because once it is gone it can not be regained. Mr. Christianson again said he thought it would be wrong to go back to the neighbors and propose any change in the plans that were agreed upon last year. Bob asked whether the Parbury property on 44th Street would be a possibility for a building site. He would be in favor of the Arneson Acres site if it is available. Marilyn Wooldridge agreed that the timing couldn't be worse to make a proposal to the Utley neighbors after the meetings that were held last year. She feels the Park Board would lose credibility if the Historical Society's site proposal were endorsed by the board. Don Wineberg also stated that even though Utley Park may be the best site choice in the estimation of the Historical Society, it would be a poor choice based on the previous year's discussions and agreements. He too felt that there was a lot of green space at Arneson Acres and would recommend looking into that site as a possibility. George Warner stated that he felt that having gone through the meetings with the Utley neighbors this would be a very poor time to bring a proposal to the public to locate the historical building in that park. It could never be done without public hearings. He agreed that Arneson Acres would be a good alternative. Bob Kojetin stated that the 44th Street property has been developed the way the neighbors in that area wanted. Bob Christianson responded that if there is activity in that area then it should be left alone. 5 Donna Skagerberg said that when the BRW report came out, the recommendation was to move all the historical buildings to Utley Park, and that was a strong consideration when the Study Committee was looking at proposal sites. Bob Kojetin commented that it is because of the meetings with the neighbors after the BRW report came out that the board is resisting the Utley site proposal. Glenn Smith concluded that it would be best for the Study Committee to investigate the possibilities of Arneson Acres as a building site and come back to the Park Board with further recommendations. IV. OTHER Joan Lonsbury presented a letter from Mary Smith to the Park Board asking for a special interpreter for her daughter who is deaf. John Keprios stated that he had talked to Mary Smith and had tried to find volunteers who might perform that task, and could not locate any volunteers. It would cost about $200 to hire a special interpreter, therefore he would need special approval. John told the Park Board that he does not know if the city is legally obligated to provide special services like this for the handicap, Hennepin County does provide services for the handicapped in nearly every program. Keprios said that we do provide some part time staff for the Edina Special Children's Group each year. Bob Christianson indicated that if it was decided to provide this special service it would probably set a precedent and any future requests would also have to be honored. Joan Lonsbury suggested that the request be forwarded to the Human Relations Board to see if they can fund something like this. Joan said she would write a letter and say we can not fund it at this time and that the request is being forwarded to the Human Relations Board. The Board agreed that would be a good idea. John Keprios handed out a tennis court report. He indicated he is concerned about going ahead and resurfacing Utley courts if there is a possibility that they would be moved. Bob Christianson was recognized and thanked for his past years of service as representative from the School Board to the Park Board. His term expired with the June 10th board meeting. Bob Kojetin announced that the Braemar Inspection Tour will be conducted the second Tuesday of September. Andy Montgomery made a motion to adjourn. Bill Lord seconded. Meeting adjourned at 10:30 p.m. 11